EU - is it worth?

[XFIRE]

Everyone knows nowadays what EU is.. European Union - The economic association of over a dozen European countries which seek to create a unified, barrier-free market for products and services throughout the continent, as well as a common currency with a unified authority over that currency bla bla..

Now, people here may be from states which are in EU or from states which aren't..

Write your opinion if it worth integrated there or not, having in view all aspects - economical, political, financial or state protection ( army ).

About us :

Romania joined EU in early 2007, with Bulgaria, after a series of discussions between our prime minister and president with european comission, after we've been tested for several years, our economy, corruption, we got many 'homeworks' to do - based on several political plans - missions.

Let's say, we accomplished them, and we got in; but, the truth is that we didn't do them all, really.. So, why we got in? Why they need us? These questions raise a lot of other secondary questions, as well as many many answers; politicians lie, lie and lie, so you can never know the truth, you can never know what they really want ( except money, ofc ), you can never know what new law or procedure is up tommorow, when you'll prolly get shocked as I do, every day I hear the news - prices will go up, prices will go up, prices will go up and this gets repeated to N.

Since we joined, I noticed our country's intent to conform to EU rules, but, I don't get why we got same prices as Italy, Germany, France, England, when medium sallary there is 1800 euro and here it is 300 euro.. and ours won't get higher in near future.. Already inflation is killing us, day by day, and I just ****en hear: "let's be like EU", "let's have laws like in EU", "prices like in EU", ****ed standars like EU, but some of us don't even have money to buy 1 damn bread a day..

Does EU really worth? Do we really need it? Was it better before or now?

[Becko0]

Imo it is the same situation here in Bulgaria. Why EU need us? A small country with so many corruption in it. As Xfire said the prices are only raising and raising and nothing changes only the life is getting harder and harder. Everyone says that before we join the EU was way better. And the politicians only scream '' Relax it will get better we are in the EU at last'' ffs yea but for normal ppl it is way hard to pay their bills to life a normal life coz of these greedy monsters who ruin our whole country. Anyway i can't believe that our country will be better i think it will go bader and bader ...

[Ykc]

i just want to be able to travel where ever i wanna without standing 2 days in que in order to get visa and pay them 30 euro for some ****s.

other than that i rly dont care about eu.

[T0mmy]

Same as Ykc said. Only for traveling w/o visa(not the credit card).

[fatman69]

well i don't mean to insult Ro guys, but i think they let u join EU cuz they needed work force that would work for anything, you people could soon be spreading all across EU just bcuz the borders are open and you could live so much better in other parts of union. it'a a win win situation for them and your people. your people get a chance for better life, they get decent work force that works for half the price domestic work force would work for.

i think EU is really a good thing, but good things take time to work out. East germany has been out of comunism for 18 years but the state there hasn't improved drasticallly. economical progress is very slow and u gotta keep your faith and optimism. another example is spain, they have become a economcial force in last 30 years , and they have been trying to acheive that since end of WW II. so it takes some time, but i think it's a lot easier to acheieve good economical state in a union with versatile market possibilites. when u think about it, it gives you many options for production, tax-free borders sure give you some advantage.

my country is "trying" to join EU. i think they are more teasing us than they actually mean to let us in. in my opinion, it would be a lot smarter for my country to try to make it on their own, regardless of how hard it is. if we were a bit more developed we wouldn't have to be like some dorky kid asking a group of other kids to let him play football with him. if we, metaphorically speaking ofc, kicked ass in football, we wouldn't have to ask some1 to play, "other kids" would ask us to play... i hope u get my point with this metaphor...

[Lord Darius]

Well yes, I think it is worth it in every way.

[straider]

hmm quite a good q, you got there, is it worth it ? hmm lets summ up, your country gets into a union that represents stability in economical, law, acounting, logistick ... after some time coz i am sure that there will , or better to say are some restrictions concerning free movement of work capital, you will get the posibility to work anywhere in the eu. I am aslo quite sure that you dont have the same prices level like in germany or italy and if yes its not because of the EU, but its because of the high inflation you mentioned. Witch can be fought with the support of the union.

And now to the better part of your q, what gets the EU? ~~ .. well its quite dificult to explain. But also just tu summ up, they need potencial, potencial witch is also in romania, potencial that in a decade will you fill they budged. Its all about the money my friend

[-toXic-]

yeah it's worth but...as i already said europa is so nationalistic.

[-eXtasY-]

Why do they need you ? Lol here are some of answers

1. Easy moving of working class which is very cheap in Ro,Bg etc
2. Place for earning money, privatization by the side of EU countrys
3. Military control , just to give them right to involve in everything , and protect their interests
4. Easy transfer of goods , so they will be able to buy raw materials for even less money and make expensive products to sell in rich countrys.

So the point is , you get almost nothing (except traveling without visa) , but you lose much . Cant you understand everything is about economy of few countrys , do u really think they care about some bg , ro , cro, serbia etc..... From ages ago , there are few on the top of the pyramid and others are just marionets who are harvesting gold mine for them. That is the answer why some rich countrys never joined EU.

[obey.my.dreamz]

Imho,.. EU was created ,..as a counter side of USA,.. and it is really good idea.
otherwise , they'd get too cocky,..(not saying that they aren't),..but still it has it's negative sides,.. U can't please everyone,.

[KeweLi]

I can't really give both sides of the arguement because I am from a Western European background. But from where I stand, the set of countries you mentioned are making progress by entering the EU. Business and tourism in Romania will develop but of course the effect will not be immediate, maybe not even a huge amount of change in the next decade. Ykc had a good point. The EU somewhat builds a more swift relationship between the countries. I am not sure about the Romanian passport, but my British one allows me to travel to almost anywhere without visa. But more importantly, it is the bond and economy that I think is vital.

[2fuckingbitch]

I want to go to see the world :D to travel somewhere and not to w8 20 days for Visa and to pay that.... But there is some things which are better when u are not in EU .. but i more prefer EU . Just to see how is it in EU :D . But i see that EU will not come soon in Serbia .. maybe i am wrong .. that's will be gr8 if i am wrong :D

[fatman69]

Why do they need you ? Lol here are some of answers

1. Easy moving of working class which is very cheap in Ro,Bg etc
2. Place for earning money, privatization by the side of EU countrys
3. Military control , just to give them right to involve in everything , and protect their interests
4. Easy transfer of goods , so they will be able to buy raw materials for even less money and make expensive products to sell in rich countrys.

So the point is , you get almost nothing (except traveling without visa) , but you lose much . Cant you understand everything is about economy of few countrys , do u really think they care about some bg , ro , cro, serbia etc..... From ages ago , there are few on the top of the pyramid and others are just marionets who are harvesting gold mine for them. That is the answer why some rich countrys never joined EU.
well your answers seem to be what any average man thinks:" they're gonna rip us, steal our lands, exploit us etc..."
no they are not, we'll do it to ourselves.
1. workforce- yes, indeed but it also provides good life for people from those countries if they decide to go abroad. that situtation would relieve bulgara/romania from many unemployed people, which would go to other countries. those lands wouldn't be burdened with unemployement probs, so they could try to invest in new production possibilities which are now open due to tax-free borders. and people working abroad might even send their families back home some cash, again improving life there.

2. place of earning money- yes but that's what the whole concept of trade and capitalism is about. if you go buy some stuff. you've got 2 products of same value and quality: 1 your country's product but 50% more expensive, and some german product. if it were something you don't use everyday you'd be a good patriot and go for your own country's ofc. but if it were a everyday necesity, like food for example, you'd think twice before buying smth 50% more expensive.

some might say it's destroying home production, well i say **** home production if it can't come close to foreign products...i mean, i am pro-buying home products, but i'm not gonna be a patriot if it means to cut my monthly funds for 30% just so "my" industry would benefit. why wouldn't "my" industry and production lower its prices for me. people kinda exploit other people's "shopping patriotism" and overcharge. so in short, i don't see any harm if some good products suddenly become cheaper...

3. military- yes protect their interests, well every1 protects his or her interests. it's easy to thrash that defending of interests now in times of piece in EU, but if the situation changes, i think you'd really want some1 who would think of you as their interest and therefore went to protect you. don't be naive, no1 is dumb enough to send their own troops to war just for the sake of peace and good will...

4. materials- i don't see anything wrong there, again every1 benefits. you sell your raw material,they make good products and make good money. if u don't feel comfortable with them making good money from your, let's say wood, then build your own frickin factory and make your own damn furniture so u make more money...simple as that.

ofc they don't care about us, but do we care about them?? no, we don't. that's why it's called economical union, not emotional union...

and the reason why swiss, norway and iceland haven't joined is pretty simple. they make good living on their own, in case you don't know those countries were the least hit by WW II. ok norway was in ww II but she was sold very quickly, so the industry wasn't harmed.
they got a head start after WW II, swiss make a pretty good living on their own from finance respectively. iceland wouldn't benefit from union cuz people could go to other countries more easily which is the last thing they need. and tax-free borders-pff- wtf r they gonna do with that, they are in the middle of nowhere...so why would they distribute their wealth with other poor countries...
EU was founded by countries in progress that needed good mutual relations in order to benefit from trade better. and as far as that gold mine metaphor goes, if you have a frickin gold mine go harvest it yourself.. if you're too dumb to exploit it, well give it to some1... simple as that

[-toXic-]

Why do they need you ? Lol here are some of answers

1. Easy moving of working class which is very cheap in Ro,Bg etc
2. Place for earning money, privatization by the side of EU countrys
3. Military control , just to give them right to involve in everything , and protect their interests
4. Easy transfer of goods , so they will be able to buy raw materials for even less money and make expensive products to sell in rich countrys.

So the point is , you get almost nothing (except traveling without visa) , but you lose much . Cant you understand everything is about economy of few countrys , do u really think they care about some bg , ro , cro, serbia etc..... From ages ago , there are few on the top of the pyramid and others are just marionets who are harvesting gold mine for them. That is the answer why some rich countrys never joined EU.

WELL BETTER STARDARD FOR NOT VERY RICH COUNTRIES.France most wonted to organize eu,and for that are 2 main reason.First:they wanted coil and steel;to get same prices on market.Second reason was confrontation between france germany.So yes they formed it;they started to get faster progress and they lvl up them self:P.So that wanted other countries and so on.Some richer countries like norway and switzerland with better stardand didnt want in eu cuz they dont get nothing from it.But for not very rich countries eu is perfect solution for better progress.

[XFIRE]

well i don't mean to insult Ro guys, but i think they let u join EU cuz they needed work force that would work for anything, you people could soon be spreading all across EU just bcuz the borders are open and you could live so much better in other parts of union. it'a a win win situation for them and your people. your people get a chance for better life, they get decent work force that works for half the price domestic work force would work for.

You ain't insulting us, but this is so ****ing true :)

Over 500.000 people emigrated in last 2 years in Spain, employing as strawberry gatherers, earning 500-800 euros/month ( much higher, even double that our medium salary value in Romania ), and return, after few years back home ( if they do return ), with money for their families.

This is one ****ing bul****, from my side, people going to work in other countries ( over 300.000 emigrated in Italy too ), stealing there, robbing, kidnapping, even murdering - all done by GIPSIES, and all european newspapers and televisions are yelling "out with them from EU"; they are making a joke of our country, as well as of themselves ( who cares ), but also, this may have dire consequences regarding our presence in EU.

Back to the topic, I kinda felt some improvements in our scolary system, some new projects, funds, new schools, repairs, donations, student incomes & other ****s, but, looking on agriculture side, it gets worse and worse; farmers are trying to fool EU, by declaring/registering invalid (fake) land areas, in order to receive funds, and they were cut off from those funds ( many innocent people got in this **** too ).

[Mr.7error]

I know that this was already said but jeez, can help it I must say this, how can prices be equal or even much higher than in a civilized country like England,France etc and the medium income 10 times smaller compared to same countries ? THAT IS TEH ****.

[ShadoWbg]

Imo it is the same situation here in Bulgaria. Why EU need us? A small country with so many corruption in it. As Xfire said the prices are only raising and raising and nothing changes only the life is getting harder and harder. Everyone says that before we join the EU was way better. And the politicians only scream '' Relax it will get better we are in the EU at last'' ffs yea but for normal ppl it is way hard to pay their bills to life a normal life coz of these greedy monsters who ruin our whole country. Anyway i can't believe that our country will be better i think it will go bader and bader ...
Well it indeed gets worse for now, but anyways im trying to be an optimist, it will be that way for a few years or ,lol , hope not decades [j/k], but it will be all ok in the end. At least i hope so.
Anyways they need us because we might be little but Bulgaria has a very good position on the European map. We hold the connection to Turkey and thus to Asia. Our land is very usefull for the trading between the two continents. They do have reasons and I guess since we are in such e pitty situation, good ones, but as Xfire said politicians lie, and im sure they'd never reveal their true intentions, because most times they aren't good.

[imaginary]

EU requires some standards not only to be able to join in but to be able to 'keep up' with the rest of the countries.
That is hard for countries that are still developin, but wanna join, or are newly developed.
An important benefit EU has to offer, is financial help, kind of 'sponsorship', to every member that needs, in order to create better industry, better facilities, buildings, roads, to develop say in one word.
Every country gets funds for such purposes.
Furthermore, countries who participate in EU can use the same currency, Euro, which is obviously easier for ppl to use when travellin inside EU instead of the different currency of each country outside EU.
Ofc a few countries have chosen not to use Euros, like UK and Sweden, for their own reasons.
Ppl travellin in countries within EU, dont need to use a passport but only their own personal common ID.
Eu members have politicians - representatives who participate in the European Parliament, discussin and takin decisions TOGETHER for issues that have to deal with EU countries or the whole EU community.
These are some of the benefits, and i consider them quite important.

[IOwnYouAll]

3. military- yes protect their interests, well every1 protects his or her interests. it's easy to thrash that defending of interests now in times of piece in EU, but if the situation changes, i think you'd really want some1 who would think of you as their interest and therefore went to protect you. don't be naive, no1 is dumb enough to send their own troops to war just for the sake of peace and good will...


well ahmn,a bit offtopic. when the war between USA and Irak broke,we romanians suported USA-from the start- with military bases on the Black Sea(like the asslickers that we are...sry ...my opinion)

ONtopic: well from entering the EU will help us(weak developed countryes AKA RO and BG),but these changes i beleve will be noticeble in mb 10 years from now. Miracoles don't happend over night :(
Oh and mb it's just in my home town,(Sibiu)but here changes are allready more noticeble. These changes were more posible because in 2007 Sibiu was the capital of european culture(along with some other city from Europe),so we got a lot of concerts last year,lots of investments and improvements.Tourists no. jumped from 200 000 /year to 1 mil,and a lot of them were not from Romania ;)
So yeah,it's a improvement for any country to enter the EU,well except Iceland and Swiss:tiphat:

[OMGBergrush]

An important benefit EU has to offer, is financial help, kind of 'sponsorship', to every member that needs, in order to create better industry, better facilities, buildings, roads, to develop say in one word.
yes so they can buy it for cheap when its all nicely built up.

Ofc a few countries have chosen not to use Euros, like UK and Sweden, for their own reasons.
yes of course because some countries can have their own reasons put above those of the others and some countries cannot. with such a blatant mockery of the equal europe idea im surprised people find the concept appealing

[XFIRE]

Ofc a few countries have chosen not to use Euros, like UK and Sweden, for their own reasons.

Romania didn't adopt Euro either..

Moreover, we changed the value of our "Leu" - "Lion" in translation to even a higher scale, by reducing 4x zeros ( 1 Leu = 10000 old Lei ).

And, I don't think our government will agree to adopt Euro too soon..

[oOGen.LaZOo]

Well , why EU ? Why not building a solid big economic State like SWITZERLAND ?


If we look closer in eu , there is nothing more special except for the easier traveling . If we want our countries to be good For us , we will look into our own region and ask ourselves : If i am able to live good in my country , to have enough money to live in comfort and to raise my own children and to let them have solid education and work , does it worth to be member in EU , and to have standard 10 times poorer than some states which share the same rights with me ?

[imaginary]

It is united Europe, the word itself should make u feel positive about it, and the goal of EU is to manage include as many european countries as possible.
Guys the benefits are definately better from joinin instead of not joinin.
Serbs shouldnt be so against it (from ur attitude i read i presume ur against it).
And well i donno about Romania and Sweden reasons not to use Euro, but UK ofc wouldnt accept it since brittish pounds are stronger (constantly losin ground though) than Euro.

[IOwnYouAll]

well,if i am properly informed,no country that entered the UE in one year used EURO the same year. Hungary is in UE since 2004,but i don't think they use EURO

Romania will use euro since 2011-2012..i think

and Sweden? amn,er..mb i'm confusing but don't u mean Swiss(Switzerland)
if it's Swiss,they don't use EURO because they aren't in EU because they don't benifit from it...they can only lose money :(

[oOGen.LaZOo]

And now ajalex gets my point about the "benefit" from EU

[The.Traveller]

This is one ****ing bul****, from my side, people going to work in other countries ( over 300.000 emigrated in Italy too ), stealing there, robbing, kidnapping, even murdering - all done by GIPSIES, and all european newspapers and televisions are yelling "out with them from EU"; they are making a joke of our country, as well as of themselves ( who cares ), but also, this may have dire consequences regarding our presence in EU.


I am not sure whether they understand or not that Gypsies do not represent the whole Romania-in fact they are a totally different "race". There are many romanians who have built a good reputation there and the insiders recognise their merits.
Romania and Bulgaria might have been accepted in EU too early. This is why these countries find it difficult to catch up with the other members.
EU has many advantages.And i don't see any point in being frustrated about politicians feeding their own interests.They always did it and will do it in future too.
Like Obey said,it's not bad that a counter to USA exists.
And the feeling of freedom and space-no matter the source-is simply spiffing.

[imaginary]

No i mean Sweden, Sweden is one country Switzerland is another, southern and smaller;D

EDIT: Wow postin at the same time rox, but obviously i was replyin to IOwnYouAll )

[XFIRE]

I am not sure whether they understand or not that Gypsies do not represent the whole Romania-in fact they are a totally different "race". There are many romanians who have built a good reputation there and the insiders recognise their merits.

Well yea, tell that to them, not me, because I already know it..

ps: gipsies represent 7% of Romanian population, with a total of about 1,5 milion ppl.. highest concentration of gipsies (not indians, their provienents!) from overall world.

[IOwnYouAll]

these days,the only romanians representing our country-in a good way- are basicly football players(itally most),and in the past,scientists(kinda) that helped in aviation and medicine,but other country sees us like that Mailat person(who BTW he is a GYPSI not a ROMANIAN) who raped and killed that italian chick.

yea..i think RO and BG have been accepted to early

PS: Lazoo it's me guta. AJ barely posts in "Serious Discussions" subforum

[oOGen.LaZOo]

And why are they called ROMI ?

[XFIRE]

And why are they called ROMI ?

Their founded comunity here took the name of RROMI ( similar to Rom - Romanian person ) rrom = gipsy; that completely sux, they're often confused with us, by people who ain't got knowledge about this or just being ignorant..

I can't ****en believe our government is sustaining them with additional funds, and has the will of calling them "Rromi" instead of "Tigani"- gipsies, after all ****s they're doing everywhere and spitting on our country's reputation.

[oOGen.LaZOo]

WE call them Romi or Tzigani here . There aren't any in my city and region but they live outside Skopje somewhere . And don't be confused we call
Romanec - Romanci here for you . :D

[IOwnYouAll]

And why are they called ROMI ?

The Romani or Romany people (Devanagari: रोमानी, as a noun, singular Rom, plural Roma; sometimes Rrom, Rroma) or Romanies are an ethnic group living in many communities all over the world. The Roma are among the best known ethnic groups that appear in literature and folklore, and are often referred to as Gypsies or Gipsies, a term that is sometimes considered pejorative and is based on a mistaken belief of an origin in Egypt.

this is from wikipedia. in romania,we call them Tigan(gypsy) or Rrom (yes,to " r ").
the info is a bit wrong. They came from INDIA,they were sclaves who were bought to serv rich ppl,so now they are free and stealing and killing and ...well you know the rest
One of my historical geek friends did some research and found out(but he doesen't belive it) that Tigan/Gypsy in some languadge means Sclave...so ye i'm sure they're from india ;)
PS: sory for going offtopic :tiphat:

[The.Traveller]

No i mean Sweden, Sweden is one country Switzerland is another, southern and smaller;D


:laugh: Switzerland is ImbA,nevertheless.It did a great job to itself! we have to admit it ...

Well yea, tell that to them, not me, because I already know it..

ps: gipsies represent 7% of Romanian population, with a total of about 1,5 milion ppl.. highest concentration of gipsies (not indians, their provienents!) from overall world.

Maybe it's time you guys clean your country up.I hope noone bothers that i am against "dirt".And romanians who go abroad would better leave their manele home :)

[IOwnYouAll]

i would,but then smurf would say i'm racist(huh...yes i am...wana make something of it?) and ask me for infractions/ban.

well about manele...it's gypsy+oriental music so...we could get 2 birds with 1 stone...the race,and they're music :D

[oOGen.LaZOo]

Smurf is rom ? ha ?

[XFIRE]

:laugh: Switzerland is ImbA,nevertheless.It did a great job to itself! we have to admit it ...

Norway also;

Didn't you all notice, that Norway + Switzerland ( only good developed countries which denied to join EU ) have highest living level, highest sallaries, less polluted territories and best founded economy? Doesn't this leave you a question mark?

Maybe it's time you guys clean your country up.I hope noone bothers that i am against "dirt".And romanians who go abroad would better leave their manele home :)

So ****en right, I would kill all those who are listening them.

And yea, time for clean-up.

[The.Traveller]

Ehehehe Norway and Switzerland were at the right time when they started it all.
Less developed countries,nowadays,have more chances to evolve through EU than by themselves.Otherwise,they would need a super ImbA "daddy" and same government to achieve it.
And since most of the politicians sux now....

[Ykc]

mby cause they were never in any wars?

anyway they live awsome there... they dont need someone to ruin it

[MLTHR25]

hi everbody;

I think you know I am from Turkey. Turkey at the Europa for Geograph and so our goverment wants to join AB. I dont want this ( my opinion) but at the global world we must protect our country so we want to this. You know our soldier power is big at the world. But travel / jop / and new age is really important.

Our story is starting.............


Turkey is the only pluralist secular democracy in the Moslem world and has always attached great importance to developing its relations with other European countries. Historically, Turkish culture has had a profound impact over much of Eastern and Southern Europe.

Turkey began "westernising" its economic, political and social structures in the 19th century. Following the First World War and the proclamation of the Republic in 1923, it chose Western Europe as the model for its new secular structure.

Turkey has ever since closely aligned itself with the West and has become a founding member of the United Nations, a member of NATO, the Council of Europe, the OECD and an associate member of the Western European Union. During the Cold War Turkey was part of the Western alliance, defending freedom, democracy and human rights. In this respect, Turkey has played and continues to play a vital role in the defence of the European continent and the principal elements of its foreign policy have converged with those of its European partners.

Having thus entered into very close cooperation with Western Europe in the political field, it was therefore only natural for Turkey to complete this in the economic area. Thus, Turkey chose to begin close cooperation with the fledgling EEC in 1959.



and ....


This year the European Commission prepared its fourth annual Progress Report for candidate countries. As all other reports, 2001 Progress Report for Turkey was announced on 13 November 2001. On the same day, the Commission also declared its Strategy Paper, introducing proposals on methods to be applied in the future, within the framework of the enlargement process.

Progress Reports evaluate the candidate states' progress towards membership only for that specific year. Compared to previous ones, there is a notable difference in this year's Report for Turkey. It was drawn up in a more careful manner in view of the momentum created by the recent constitutional amendments. Those matters that were found wanting were also enumerated in the same way.

we are continue...........


Maybe 2012 we can join I dont know :(

[fatman69]

:laugh: Switzerland is ImbA,nevertheless.It did a great job to itself! we have to admit it ...

did a great job at what?? they didn't have any losses in like 200 years, i suppose it's so hard to maintain economy in that state...

as far as romania goes, i think at least 10-15 years will be necesary for changes to be noticable.but as Iownyouall said, some of the changes are apparent even today.
i'm not for EU although i think it's a great idea, ffs, what do you think, would USA be as developed as today if it were all 52 states for themselves??
this is a slightly better and improved idea, there are flaws, but i think all in all, most countries will benefit from it. i see a lot of scepticism (berg notably) that EU countries will buy your land, well don't sell the frickin lands!!

again i'm agaisnt it, not bcuz i don't like the idea, but my people have waited 900 years for our independence, and now after 20 years of independence,another union..man :( :(

[Bonzy]

about swiss and norway situation , it goes like this... during big wars like WW1 and WW2 nobody gives a **** about so badly positioned countries (switzerland-100% in highest parts of alps ; norway-"at the edge of nothing" country) so noone has any reason why to conquer it-->they stay neutral. In sweden are also one of the best living standards , same goes for finland...denmark...iceland...etc...mostly all nordic countries...

[OMGBergrush]

Guys the benefits are definately better from joinin instead of not joinin.
Serbs shouldnt be so against it (from ur attitude i read i presume ur against it).
why the hell should i join up with those who wish harm to my people who condone the desecration of our holy land and who wish to illegally steal our land? wtf is your problem cant you see how much harm they are doing us?

well don't sell the frickin lands!!

and who do you think you are to refuse? its all europe its all free market you sell to the highest bidder. its not the closed communist state owned market. and since your country doesnt have enough guns to MAKE them not buy your land i guess you either dont join or you join and sell out.

[imaginary]

LaL to wtf is my problem..
Berg :)
K dont join EU.

MLTHR25, is France still totally negative towards Turkey joinin the EU? Cause they've been puttin u off quite obviously last years..

[LSD_efect]

Why is Turkey consider to be part of Europe?and why Turkey and Izrael? play EU football?They are not IN Europe.

[MLTHR25]

LaL to wtf is my problem..
Berg :)
K dont join EU.

MLTHR25, is France still totally negative towards Turkey joinin the EU? Cause they've been puttin u off quite obviously last years..

yea I know France is still negative to turkey joining. Ban France pls :D:D:D:D

France learn to win but France forget to lost .. we help them always but know I dont understand.

[OMGBergrush]

France learn to win but France forget to lost .. we help them always but know I dont understand. [/B]

you sure helped them in ww1 thats for sure...

[fatman69]

why the hell should i join up with those who wish harm to my people who condone the desecration of our holy land and who wish to illegally steal our land? wtf is your problem cant you see how much harm they are doing us?
yeah they are destroying you...guys is it just me or does berg really remind you of that Hyde dude from "That's the 70's show"?all that mass media global conspiracy ideas. get out of your cave, man



and who do you think you are to refuse? its all europe its all free market you sell to the highest bidder. its not the closed communist state owned market. and since your country doesnt have enough guns to MAKE them not buy your land i guess you either dont join or you join and sell out.

where have you ever seen a case where a man from EU(or any other part of "free world") forced another to sell his lands to him?? he can't put a gun to your head and say:sell me your lands or i'll shoot! christ, it's people, yours and mine that sell their lands to foreigners and then call themselves "patriots". if you feel partiotic don't sell a single piece of land you own, not in any case.

one more thing, you say it's wrong that they buy your lands, well can you honestly say that you would be better if you were in their shoes, meaning you had the money and power to buy some land you liked?? you would also buy that land, make it a hotel, factory, race track, dump same as they do. only difference between those people and you is that you don't have the money. if the situtation were different ... oh, and by "you" i don't mean just berg, or serbs, or whatever, so you don't get the wrong impression. this was aimed towards any1, including myself..

[MLTHR25]

you sure helped them in ww1 thats for sure...


yea ı am sure . My country always help to France but france chanced.....

[Lord Darius]

yea ı am sure . My country always help to France but france chanced.....

That was sarcasm, hellooooo!

[The.Traveller]

did a great job at what?? they didn't have any losses in like 200 years, i suppose it's so hard to maintain economy in that state...

again i'm agaisnt it, not bcuz i don't like the idea, but my people have waited 900 years for our independence, and now after 20 years of independence,another union..man :( :(

They did a great job with themselves! Becoming neutral brought them only advantages,now almost nothing can touch them and you can't blame them for not having any losses.Good for them! And it's not called in vain "The fiscal paradise".


why the hell should i join up with those whowish harm to my people who condone the desecration of our holy land and who wish to illegally steal our land? wtf is your problem cant you see how much harm they are doing us?


Berg,no matter whether you exagarate or not,but how did you expect EU to react?! Send you flowers and greeting cards and ask politely how are things going with Russia?? It's nothing surprising,whenever these two parts are involved,EU and Russia.

Why is Turkey consider to be part of Europe?and why Turkey and Izrael? play EU football?They are not IN Europe.

This is same as asking why Russia participates at EUROvision. Inexplicable O.O
No offence,but Turkey doesn't deserve to be in EU.But ofc because of its strategic location,politicians won't overlook it.

[Slayzer]

Serbia was always part of Europe and I cant see reason why we still arent in EU

[XFIRE]

Serbia was always part of Europe and I cant see reason why we still arent in EU

Is your leader's fault, kill him!

[The.Traveller]

Serbia was always part of Europe and I cant see reason why we still arent in EU

Because it can't have both Russia and EU.Serbia has to choose between these two.

[fatman69]

This is same as asking why Russia participates at EUROvision. Inexplicable O.O
No offence,but Turkey doesn't deserve to be in EU.But ofc because of its strategic location,politicians won't overlook it.

well russia participates at eurovision bcuz it mostly is in Europe, when thinking in terms of population, majoritiy of their bigger cities is on EU side + their capital... so i don't see why not?

well turkey is 5% in EU, and yes strategic location means a lot, but it's also a bridge through 2 cultures-european and asian-interract. and in that interacion, turkey has lately leaned more to eu side, though it's asianly oriented, regarding population and religion.

israel is definetly not part of eu, it doesn't even come close to the borders so it will surely never become a part of EU(eu=europe, EU=e.Union). but it participates in our football qualifications because of the zones that FIFA set, so it has better competition, cuz let's face it, asiian football blows big time. i think this is the reason they put them in our group. and they are on eurosong cuz they lean more to european cultural circle than they lean to asian, jewish part of population that is. that, and bonds they have with western world made them a part of that "glamorous" competition, which i find more revolting each year that passes by.

[OMGBergrush]

Berg,no matter whether you exagarate or not,but how did you expect EU to react?! Send you flowers and greeting cards and ask politely how are things going with Russia?? It's nothing surprising,whenever these two parts are involved,EU and Russia.
you think i care what the eu thinks? i only care for historic facts and if you look a bit more behind that your own birth you will see that russia has always supported us whereas eu has always worked against us.

Serbia was always part of Europe and I cant see reason why we still arent in EU
and i cant see reason why we should join the eu? do you want laws protecting ***s and sects and all that liberal ****? i know that i dont. as for going to eu countries i couldnt care less for visiting countries that are filled with people who brought to power those who wish me, my people nad my country harm.

Because it can't have both Russia and EU.Serbia has to choose between these two.
the correct choice is more than obvious.

[LSD_efect]

guys is it just me or does berg really remind you of that Hyde dude from "That's the 70's show"?all that mass media global conspiracy ideas. get out of your cave, man


haha yea.just imagine him siting in the basement on him LapTop suroundet by newspapers with his rifle next to him cursing something like "damn Eu...serbia,serbia" hahaha

[The.Traveller]

well russia participates at eurovision bcuz it mostly is in Europe, when thinking in terms of population, majoritiy of their bigger cities is on EU side + their capital... so i don't see why not?

well turkey is 5% in EU, and yes strategic location means a lot, but it's also a bridge through 2 cultures-european and asian-interract. and in that interacion, turkey has lately leaned more to eu side, though it's asianly oriented, regarding population and religion.

israel is definetly not part of eu, it doesn't even come close to the borders so it will surely never become a part of EU(eu=europe, EU=e.Union). but it participates in our football qualifications because of the zones that FIFA set, so it has better competition, cuz let's face it, asiian football blows big time. i think this is the reason they put them in our group. and they are on eurosong cuz they lean more to european cultural cle than they lean to asian, jewish part of population that is. that, and bonds they have with western world made them a part of that "glamorous" competition, which i find more revolting each year that passes by.

Which proves again that Eurovision isn't thoroughly a music contest,it's more a political one.But this is the least problem Europe has.I believe as soon Turkey would join EU turks will begin to spread all over Europe,trying to impose their own rules,lifestyle,religion,marry european women and the rest is already common sense.They do not respect other nations.Exceptions tehre always are ofc.
I wish someone come and contradict me.But this is what happens now when they are still out,let alone what will happen after joining.But ofc politicians will be the only one to benefit and the turks themselves.

you think i care what the eu thinks? i only care for historic facts and if you look a bit more behind that your own birth you will see that russia has always supported us whereas eu has always worked against us.

the correct choice is more than obvious.

Berg Berg.....EU is against Serbia being allied with Russia.But if u join EU ofc the situation would be different.They don't want Russia sticking their nose in Europe's business and that's exactly what Russia tries to do.Why don't you go live in Russia if you are so against EU and Europe? Noone stops you.

[OMGBergrush]

Berg Berg.....EU is against Serbia being allied with Russia.But if u join EU ofc the situation would be different.They don't want Russia sticking their nose in Europe's business and that's exactly what Russia tries to do.Why don't you go live in Russia if you are so against EU and Europe? Noone stops you.

so when russia wants to have an ally in europe or have a missile base or two there its very bad but when the usa has dozens of bases in europe ships cruising european seas and spy satellites orbiting over europe than that is absolutely fine.
russia isnt keeping their nose in eu business this IS their business especially since the usa is blatantly surrounding them with rocket bases like ghouls surround a soon-to-be dead archmage.
and a final note i have no intention of leaving my own country because my ancestors gave their lives to make it and to protect it. you on the other hand if you like having *** marriages or legalized sects bent on moral degradation please feel free to gtfo of serbia and live in europe because i sure am not going to let such moral degradation flourish on the soil my grandfathers died to protect.

[The.Traveller]

so when russia wants to have an ally in europe or have a missile base or two there its very bad but when the usa has dozens of bases in europe ships cruising european seas and spy satellites orbiting over europe than that is absolutely fine.
russia isnt keeping their nose in eu business this IS their business especially since the usa is blatantly surrounding them with rocket bases like ghouls surround a soon-to-be dead archmage.
and a final note i have no intention of leaving my own country because my ancestors gave their lives to make it and to protect it. you on the other hand if you like having *** marriages or legalized sects bent on moral degradation please feel free to gtfo of serbia and live in europe because i sure am not going to let such moral degradation flourish on the soil my grandfathers died to protect.

Oh Berg,please come back! You are gone too far away.What do *** marriages and sects have to do with our discussions??
I know both USA and Russia love very much Europe,but my point was to not be surprised about the negative attitude of EU.Russia doesn't want to simply have an ally.And what happens behind-the-scences only they know.I cannot claim anything.
But this doesn't make EU worthless.One lives in Europe,ofc one will be first of all pro eu and pro EU rather than pro "neighbours".
Imho

[OMGBergrush]

when you join eu you get eu laws you get eu regulations and you get eu money. im saying that we are better off w/o these things. in fact the only thing we gain from eu is money which we can make on our own and through our russian partners and the other is no visa restrictions which they will give us anyway because they want to bribe us into joining them and besides ive no intention of visiting my enemies

[fatman69]

dude not every1 besides russia is your enemy, for instance, brits have always favored you serbs.

well wether you want *** marriages or not, they'll come sooner or later. i'm definetly opposed but u just gotta live with it. if you're such a keeper of that archaic good moral, why don't you just go marry next girl you ****. again i hate *** marriages but the times are changin and the old moral doesnt go anymore. again if you're gonna tell me if you are against that liberal bull****, are you against weed, strip-clubs, one-night chix?? your fathers fought against that kind of immoral in the same way as they fought fags

[SetoKaiba]

its not right time for us to join eu , at stage Serbia curently is we will loose more than gain by doing so.

must go to work so i dont have time atm to explain.

[Kominterna]

ROFL MAO, Herr voted for We aren't in EU, but I would like to be.
ROFL Br In EU =))

[skywalker3]

ROFL MAO, Herr voted for
ROFL Br In EU =))

looolss ...brasil in European Union?? auhauhauha

On-Topic : i see a lot of guys who hate gypsis and their stupid music called "manele" so why dont we start a riot or something?? we can do this in every city in Romania so we can get rid of them for EVER !

Romania would be 10 times better without the gypsis... (no offense please) but u know that`s the truth ...

What can i say ... Eu`s funds were good for us and i hope they wont ask back for those money coz our economy is worse every day !

[The.Traveller]

At least get them out of EU would be a good thing,not only for Romania.

[imaginary]

If u wanna talk about gypsies in particular open a new thread, just be careful with the content cause no matter what experience u have with them and opinion, they are humans too.

[LSD_efect]

they are not humans they are...how do you say "tovar" in every society

[Lord Darius]

Herr just voted that he would like to be in the European Union, what the hell you laughing for?
After all, Brasil needs EU.

[sakky]

EU is lol.
bosnia did nothing and they actually help us to join. i wouldnt surprise if in about 10 years of more trying they say "ok heres your invitation".
serbia did even less and they will probably join expressly in 5 years.

to tell its about economy to determine if you join or not, its just dumb..... (romania is lol. and its nothing new, e.g. when they let portugal in, portugal was one of the poorest countries at that time, and although its still poorest of the 'old member' the progress is clearly visible).
to tell its about political situation, is dumb too (they even offered yugoslavia to join during the period when it was colapsing and with bilions of dolars of help, not to forget when spain joined which was the situation there etc).
to tell its about religion, its just funny. bosnia and albania are mostly muslim states and they are trying to put both states in. not to mention significant % in several other states. and besides, i really dont know how it goes in western europe guys, but in eastern europe it goes like this. every nation has IT OWN churches and mosques.
to tell tell its about geography, its just lol. cyprus joined and it doesn't belong even 1 mm^2 in europe by such criteria. not to mention certain states that are far more than even israel and egypt together, and which are still having some ways of 'special treatment' although they wont enter.
to tell its about russian influence and to isolate russia etc. why would tey let in potential russian satelites. to tell you guys, its not just serbia that has people 'pro russian'. or maybe bulgaria. or montenegro or some other state. here in bosnia general view of russia is like 'bretherens'. when it come sabout some questions that arent affecting us in any way, and when USA and russia are arguing, even my own father says 'now lets **** them, russia this that bla bla' stories like 'ne bojte se štuka i aviona, nas i rusa ima 300 miliona' (dont be feared by štuke and airplanes, us and russians count 300 milions, some old slang paroles). although russia was on serbian side during balkans wars and although general view of russia is like 'those *******s', and still all that when it comes to something.
not to forget that yugoslavian resistance started not when we got occupied (only serbs were fighting for kingdom of yugoslavia in ww2, others didnt care seeing it as opression anyways), but when 'brothers' were attacked.
main way to get off the responsibility of russia of anything they (dont) do is:
"ne slovite oštro na brata ruskog
i on ratuje protiv vraga mrskog"
(some old ****, to excuse russians from everything, says dont be harsh words against our brother russians, they also fight against our common enemy. its allways irrational hoping in russians, tey often did and still do ****).

if you would just hear all the songs about 'brothers' you would go lol. especially when i take in consideraion russain infulence and siding with serbia (at least by words and diplomatical acts). thats irrational way of seing russia in here. allways some sindrom of small countries towards 'them'.
i really don't know if austria or nederlands have such way of tihnking towards germany, and if it brought them same **** like it brought to us. but lets return to topic. do you guys even know that EU is having plans to have russia in it in the next 50 years at most? are you aware of that when you say its just about making pressure upon russia? give me a break.


lets sum it up. EU is an IDEOLOGICAL project. and it is a POLITICAL project. the people pulling strings rather choose to go wit it slowly. its purpose is seen in the centuries to come, and its a dream about united and strong europe. although old rivalries, daily politics, religion, geography, size, economy, and all those things are playing certain role, main reason why certain states are going to get invited or not is determined on plans that EU has and thinking of certain people that are actually financing all that (those are allawys people with big money of themselves and want to do something historical with it, but not some bull****). for example, they have in plan to get bosnia in EU, although its naive to think bosnia is, or any other balkans state so much needed in EU. its rather to say that we need them more when it comes to that. although in the end you need nobody, and nobody needs anybody.

now i ll tell you how i see relation of bosnia and balkans generaly towards EU.
we do nothing. and they give us some small priviledges all the way. and say that we make progress, by our politicians just giving words. and then people tend to speak "they really need us, like world would end if we dont join, our economy is having super potential" or 'jebo zemlju koja bosne nema' (**** the country that has no bosnia in it:D) and all those funny stuff.

and as i said, even bigger lol is serbia. its actually good to see berg telling what he tells, so you can know what kind of person he really is.
and to tell you all, that is the way how at least 50%+ of average serbians think.
although they practically did nothing to Eu except maybe paperwork (which is nothing on balkans, nobody follows paper unless he is forced), no reform is done. and EU forgave 2/3 of their debt towards them. gave billions of dollars of help to build infrastructure. its more than even NATO (read: america) destroyed when they acted dumb last time trying to play the superforce (and EU even asked USA to go easy on them, lol general clark wanted to roll over with tanks into belgrade to humiliate them).
its nothing new, and its the way balkans work. allways some overrating.
ofcourse some people will use new situation to get richer. but its very logical to conclude balkans would get more and will be better to join when you look at it. its also logical to conclude that everyone wins in a way.
but no. here it goes like "watching into neighbour's cow until it dies" politics.

more about the EU itself.
here in bosnia our politicians often mock with top EU politicians, tell ****s etc. and they are favouring us. in fact i think those guys think that our monkeys will stop if they act nice. serbian politicians do same, and they even put a new level of idiot converations, when 2 of their top politicians sent ultimatums to EU:D. and as i see, on the other hand our western neighbour croatia filled all demands on time, turkey filled some and partially. turkey will stay 'lifetime candidate' unless some big **** happens and EU lets them join fast not to make big crisis. and croatia might join because they did all, but they just wont... unless their new prime minister's politics (about acting like politicians in bosnia nad sebia do) gives fruits. he actually started to copycat bosnian strat like "we dont care, get easy on us".

bosnian strat of joining goes like this (at least i see it this way)
"hey thats too much, we dont care, do it for us, give us a break, give some easier task"... a lot of time passes and nothing being done.
then EU sends more money for infrastructure (that money allways ends in corrupted politician's pockets here on balkans). EU gives some simbolic demands. our politicians say "no deal, no way. still we want to join, but give us a break, you are dumb". then EU top politicians come, lobby for help to bosnian infrastructure, anticorruption teams, give loads of money, our politicians do same. and then EU gives little more priviledges.

don't get me wrong, but i think in the end when croatia enters (it will be the only one that deserved to enter to make it clear, and they have BNP higher than many EU states anyways, all other candidates and states are making fun around and do nothing concrete except funny stuff, talks and promises, when it comes in practical things almost nothing in general), EU wont know what to do with bosnia and how to keep things around. then we might join in 5-10 years later, and we might have same priviledges to enter croatia like now (and believe me, situation is too complex to explain, but as a result, bosnia & herzegovina has many agreements with croatia so our citizens will be like free to roam around EU if there would be no ****ing slovenian border, they dont like us there). and serbia might enter expressly although they do even more ****s than we do (honestly, we should get zero '0' mark, and they should get -10 mark for reforms done).
now comes funny sutff. EU might even give invitations to us even if we dont do anything by some claims. so... in such situation only way i see it so that we dont enter is:
when we get invitation, our politicians aruge and block it for lifetime.

and serbia not to enter (in such situation) is:
their politicians to say "**** EU we gave you ultimatum now we refuse to do any biz with you".

now to continue.... how to avoid our politicians to stop joining any more?
i think americans might involve. as you know, many influent americans are also helping EU to succeed and many of them because of ideological reasons as well. and they get very angry when they see some stupid politicians trying to act tough just because someone is giving them a chance to do so.
as you might know, many people around on balkans consider EU as sissies, while americans are the guy with the hammer.
that is because here on balkans, politics is based on resolute attitudes. and EU is prone to change its own decision, and are often being inconsistent and whores as we say it. while USA is like what they say thats what they do.
most obvious of such bull**** is serbian prime minister who gave ultimatums, threated to EU, and threated open war against EU forces on kosovo (and then kept his mouth shut when americans threated to him trying to solve things he messed up). i mean, it really goes funny on this balkans when its about EU.

[Lich_King2]

I think Eu just wants to make from others poor countrys like serbia there peons and because here is working strentgh cheaper

[Lord Darius]

I think Eu just wants to make from others poor countrys like serbia there peons and because here is working strentgh cheaper

And I think you are dumb, period.

EU is an UNION, understand? UNION.

[The.Traveller]

Since when has EU become the black sheep of the "family"??
N/c

[MLTHR25]

I think Eu just wants to make from others poor countrys like serbia there peons and because here is working strentgh cheaper

poor country lol eu is rich ?

[XFIRE]

poor country lol eu is rich ?

lol, it is formed by richest and highest-leveled European countries, so you can be sure they're rich; but also, they are investing billions of euros to new integrated countries, who need funds, to help them in their technological/economical advance.

[Bonzy]

they are investing billions of euros to new integrated countries, who need funds, to help them in their technological/economical advance.

ye , and satan gives free lolypops...

they take more of us than they give us....

[XFIRE]

ye , and satan gives free lolypops...

they take more of us than they give us....

How the **** do you know that, if you even aren't in EU?

How can you state things that are completely reverse, THOUGH you have NO idea how being in EU is; and probably, you'll never be.

they take more of us than they give us....

Once again, you AREN'T in EU so don't turn them in the 'black sheep' as someone said before.

[OMGBergrush]

How the **** do you know that, if you even aren't in EU?

How can you state things that are completely reverse, THOUGH you have NO idea how being in EU is; and probably, you'll never be.

Once again, you AREN'T in EU so don't turn them in the 'black sheep' as someone said before.

this is the 21st century so its pretty hard to keep a secret especially about big investments and stuff. for instance you may enjoy your pitiful bread crums given to you by the eu in return for obedience and exploitation but to us the price is a whole lot bigger because they not only want the usual from us they also demand that we say its ok to steal our land and give it to those who expelled so many serbs and burned down churches etc. some politicians may even do that but the people will definitely not accept such a thing and the fact that eu cant tell the usa to **** off just proves how weak and disorganized they are

[The.Traveller]

It's me It's me,XFIRE xD

m22,do pls become a politician! Just a politician! I am sure you will give all your money and salaries to the ones in need,not caring at all for your own pocket!
EU is officially enough rich.Unofficially-more than rich.But they cannot simply begin spread money everywhere "Oh,u poor country,need 10 billions euros? No problems! Take,here!"
There are many other factors that are taken into consideration.
In USA money reach the state of putrefaction,but they do not offer them all,just like that.There are certain reasons ofc.
So funds are given following a limit.

[Bonzy]

How the **** do you know that, if you even aren't in EU?

How can you state things that are completely reverse, THOUGH you have NO idea how being in EU is; and probably, you'll never be.



Once again, you AREN'T in EU so don't turn them in the 'black sheep' as someone said before.

I'm talking about that because I know it is that way. Why do I hear you complaining about EU if you think they give more then they get? Why did young people from France protest about economical down-fall in their country? Why is in Italy average salary less then years ago when EU didn't have much influence on them and back in time when they didn't have euro as valute? Why are many more countries in EU complaining about worse life then it was? Some are not complaining about life being worse , but are complaining about not developing at all...

and between , I can't see you thinking straight when for example you have racistic opinion about gipsies , they are people too , having their dreams and feelings , just like you , they are not different except in amount of money they got... there are even probably much better people who are gipsies then you are.

[fatman69]

I'm talking about that because I know it is that way. Why do I hear you complaining about EU if you think they give more then they get? Why did young people from France protest about economical down-fall in their country? Why is in Italy average salary less then years ago when EU didn't have much influence on them and back in time when they didn't have euro as valute? Why are many more countries in EU complaining about worse life then it was? Some are not complaining about life being worse , but are complaining about not developing at all...


people are losing jobs because the new trend has come to the civilised world called deindustrialisation, means closing of old-school factoris and conversion to production in high-tech industry, a lot of people lose their job in the process, but those people are mere workers. it takes some time till that process finishes, as it takes time for new-comers to EU to get aclimatised to the state in EU.

i'm just wondering how some of you really think that 27 states and a half a milllion people are wrong, and only 3-5 serbs on this forum know that EU is ****??

[The.Traveller]

and between , I can't see you thinking straight when for example you have racistic opinion about gipsies , they are people too , having their dreams and feelings , just like you , they are not different except in amount of money they got... there are even probably much better people who are gipsies then you are.

Ask yourself if these gypsies consider you as a people.The very little percentage of those who receive some education are to be taken into account.But most of them are criminals,thieves,little children always caring knives,provoking fights which end with deaths of some of them,drug dealers,attacking non-gypsy citizens,killing and so on.All the package!
There are enough real cases which happened in EU.And once again,they should not be allowed to stroll all around EU,unless they have education and manners.
Asking whether EU is worth or not is like asking if USA is worth or not [-(
What's the point of USA since it is so rich and doesn't make more donations to the world's poor countries....

[Bonzy]

Ask yourself if these gypsies consider you as a people.The very little percentage of those who receive some education are to be taken into account.But most of them are criminals,thieves,little children always caring knives,provoking fights which end with deaths of some of them,drug dealers,attacking non-gypsy citizens,killing and so on.All the package!
There are enough real cases which happened in EU.And once again,they should not be allowed to stroll all around EU,unless they have education and manners.
Asking whether EU is worth or not is like asking if USA is worth or not [-(
What's the point of USA since it is so rich and doesn't make more donations to the world's poor countries....

And what do you think , why are they criminals , thieves , drug dealers? Because they are doing it to survive , just as you would do if your life depends of it. And they maybe don't consider us people because we never did good for them , never gave them a chance , always behaved bad to them , noone was giving them jobs , so they had to search garbage to find something to eat or start being criminals and thieves and all that they are. If we gave them a chance they would maybe become something , not a bad part of some community. Think about it , how dark are their minds , because of so bad life they are having , starving and getting infections , viruses etc , ofcourse they should hate us because we are one of the main reasons of this. If we were acting like PEOPLE to them then maybe they would not hate us.

people are losing jobs because the new trend has come to the civilised world called deindustrialisation, means closing of old-school factoris and conversion to production in high-tech industry, a lot of people lose their job in the process, but those people are mere workers. it takes some time till that process finishes, as it takes time for new-comers to EU to get aclimatised to the state in EU.

i'm just wondering how some of you really think that 27 states and a half a milllion people are wrong, and only 3-5 serbs on this forum know that EU is ****??

All I am saying is the fact that too many complain about EU for it to be good. And you should cut your bull**** about us "3-5 serbs knowing what eu is" because that is not only our opinion , but an opinion of many people as I said earlier. And about deindustrialisation part , well , is it really helping when only factory owners and few people that work there become rich while 70% other have to fight hard to even survive? The problem is that nobody gives a f.uck about that... newer and newer machines will take people's jobs as the time goes and more and more will be unemployed and there will be 10% rich and 90% poor witch will look like in time few decades ago...

[The.Traveller]

And what do you think , why are they criminals , thieves , drug dealers? Because they are doing it to survive , just as you would do if your life depends of it. And they maybe don't consider us people because we never did good for them , never gave them a chance , always behaved bad to them , noone was giving them jobs , so they had to search garbage to find something to eat or start being criminals and thieves and all that they are. If we gave them a chance they would maybe become something , not a bad part of some community. Think about it , how dark are their minds , because of so bad life they are having , starving and getting infections , viruses etc , ofcourse they should hate us because we are one of the main reasons of this. If we were acting like PEOPLE to them then maybe they would not hate us.

That's very very stupid from your part,no offence! Why there are human trafficants,because they need to survive!!! Were you using your brain when u wrote this???
Gypsies dnt want to work,they better need your expensive cell phone and your wallet with money,they give a s*** on your being kind towards them.No good they will bring to their country,let alone the others from EU.
Geez...

All I am saying is the fact that too many complain about EU for it to be good. And you should cut your bull**** about us "3-5 serbs knowing what eu is" because that is not only our opinion , but an opinion of many people as I said earlier. And about deindustrialisation part , well , is it really helping when only factory owners and few people that work there become rich while 70% other have to fight hard to even survive? The problem is that nobody gives a f.uck about that... newer and newer machines will take people's jobs as the time goes and more and more will be unemployed and there will be 10% rich and 90% poor witch will look like in time few decades ago...

Nowadays intellectual work is promoted.No more 20th century.It's over! Communistic attitude is not for EU and not for 21st century either.

[Smurf]

Ask yourself if these gypsies consider you as a people.The very little percentage of those who receive some education are to be taken into account.But most of them are criminals,thieves,little children always caring knives,provoking fights which end with deaths of some of them,drug dealers,attacking non-gypsy citizens,killing and so on.All the package!
There are enough real cases which happened in EU.And once again,they should not be allowed to stroll all around EU,unless they have education and manners.
Asking whether EU is worth or not is like asking if USA is worth or not [-(
What's the point of USA since it is so rich and doesn't make more donations to the world's poor countries....

Oh really ?
No offence,but you have some short-minded,egoistic affirmations which needs to be straiten up.
1st: You don't know all gipsies,therefore you can't compare them or give them any classifications whatsoever.
By knowing few of them or by reading what media wants you to see is pretty stupid,if you ask me.
You can't,by any meaning,judge few millions people ( which are also humans,btw) just by observing ( or being sure you know them ) couple of thousands ( even less ).
Some of you guys ( not just you,the.traveler) have the idea they've seen it all just cause they watched the news,you think you know a man ( or an entire kind ) just by seeing it rarely ( or not at all ).
You need to lay back,study,and i mean really study,then start making statements.
'most of them are criminals ' OH PLEASE ! give me a break...tell me,how many gipsies have you seen in your life ?
Just cause you see 20-30 on tv every day ( which is not true ) doesn't mean all few millions are like that.
'little children always carrying knives' AHAHAH ? You watched too many cop movies,my friend.
This is not a cartoon,we are not Ninjas,and neither are gipsies ( or their children ) .
' provoking fights which end with deaths of some of them,drug dealers,attacking non-gypsy citizens,killing and so on ' Wtf are they ? Beasts?,dragon slayers?,mutants ?
If that's thruth and they eat garbage,they beg and steal your wallet,then where do they get the money to buy,then deal drugs ?
I guess they sent their little children (carrying knives ) to fight armed ( machine guns and stuff ) real drug dealers and steal away cocain and stuff.
Yeah,that's it.
Oh,and about Usa....having that number of people to take care of and so many things to pay for,i'm guessing they're not that rich.
I've read in a book called ' Secret Kingdom ',written by Pat Robertson ( an actual american,highly intelligent man,having degrees and stuff ) saying the american economy is decreasing by day and ( in 2005 ) it got to the lowest rate from past 20 years,inflation growing thunderly,etc.
Now please tell me this is something you knew.
If not,i guess you were just hearing out the wrong news,and you should stop doing it.
Cheers ~

[The.Traveller]

Oh really ?
No offence,but you have some short-minded,egoistic affirmations which needs to be straiten up.
1st: You don't know all gipsies,therefore you can't compare them or give them any classifications whatsoever.
By knowing few of them or by reading what media wants you to see is pretty stupid,if you ask me.
You can't,by any meaning,judge few millions people ( which are also humans,btw) just by observing ( or being sure you know them ) couple of thousands ( even less ).
Some of you guys ( not just you,the.traveler) have the idea they've seen it all just cause they watched the news,you think you know a man ( or an entire kind ) just by seeing it rarely ( or not at all ).
You need to lay back,study,and i mean really study,then start making statements.
'most of them are criminals ' OH PLEASE ! give me a break...tell me,how many gipsies have you seen in your life ?
Just cause you see 20-30 on tv every day ( which is not true ) doesn't mean all few millions are like that.
'little children always carrying knives' AHAHAH ? You watched too many cop movies,my friend.
This is not a cartoon,we are not Ninjas,and neither are gipsies ( or their children ) .
' provoking fights which end with deaths of some of them,drug dealers,attacking non-gypsy citizens,killing and so on ' Wtf are they ? Beasts?,dragon slayers?,mutants ?
If that's thruth and they eat garbage,they beg and steal your wallet,then where do they get the money to buy,then deal drugs ?
I guess they sent their little children (carrying knives ) to fight armed ( machine guns and stuff ) real drug dealers and steal away cocain and stuff.
Yeah,that's it.
Oh,and about Usa....having that number of people to take care of and so many things to pay for,i'm guessing they're not that rich.
I've read in a book called ' Secret Kingdom ',written by Pat Robertson ( an actual american,highly intelligent man,having degrees and stuff ) saying the american economy is decreasing by day and ( in 2005 ) it got to the lowest rate from past 20 years,inflation growing thunderly,etc.
Now please tell me this is something you knew.
If not,i guess you were just hearing out the wrong news,and you should stop doing it.
Cheers ~

Oh yeah,really!
Alas,my words are not based on what i hear on the news -.-
And i took care of both literate and illiterate parts,u just needed to read more attentively.It's not egoistic afirmations,it's the reality.
End of story.To be continued in a thread about gypsies.Thnx
My point,this is one of the disadvantages of EU.Anyone can go over to another country,even those with bad intentions,which provokes conflicts between nations and countries.
No,i didn't read that book,but it is same as TV-both being similar sources of information.But then again,for the slower minds,i meant that the amount of funds a country offers doesn't make it less or more worth.So,you can't critisize negatively EU just because it doesn't give enough money to someone.
It doesn't depend on EU only,it depends on your own leader how he deals with EU too.

[XFIRE]

Oh yeah,really!
Alas,my words are not based on what i hear on the news -.-
And i took care of both literate and illiterate parts,u just needed to read more attentively.It's not egoistic afirmations,it's the reality.
End of story.To be continued in a thread about gypsies.Thnx
My point,this is one of the disadvantages of EU.Anyone can go over to another country,even those with bad intentions,which provokes conflicts between nations and countries.
No,i didn't read that book,but it is same as TV-both being similar sources of information.But then again,for the slower minds,i meant that the amount of funds a country offers doesn't make it less or more worth.So,you can't critisize negatively EU just because it doesn't give enough money to someone.
It doesn't depend on EU only,it depends on your own leader how he deals with EU too.

I don't know why the **** we both think in same way..

And, Stefan, you're completely wrong here..

[fatman69]

And about deindustrialisation part , well , is it really helping when only factory owners and few people that work there become rich while 70% other have to fight hard to even survive? The problem is that nobody gives a f.uck about that... newer and newer machines will take people's jobs as the time goes and more and more will be unemployed and there will be 10% rich and 90% poor witch will look like in time few decades ago...

yea very sad story... have you ever thought for a sec that those people had their chance to choose maybe a different line of work, something that had a perspective. no, ppl go on thinking they can work as phisical labor for their entire life, well **** that, times are changing.

you can't work as a physical labor anymore, it's a fact. get re-qualification. it's you who have to adapt to world and other, not the other way around.

ppl who hold those factories didn't open them to support people, they oppened them to earn money, to earn as much as possible and provide good living. when you find an alternative that is more economical, which provides you bigger profit, of course you're gonna go for it.

it is unfair but, life is unfair. you mean to tell me that if you were an owner of a factory, you would hold your workers just cuz u care for ppl.. gimme a break.every one goes only for his benefit,


i'm just saying that people get fired sometimes cuz of their lousy choices, there will always be a job for educatedand hard-working people. if you know that fact, just get a good education for a job that has a perspective.
if you think you can work as warehouse employee for the rest of your life, it's your own damn fault you got fired..

[imaginary]

Are u for real ppl??
Which part of "if u wanna talk about gypsies open a new thread about them" do u not understand??!

Anyway, i wouldnt suggest u do that anymore, because its rather obvious such thread wont go "well".

[Smurf]

Are u for real ppl??
Which part of "if u wanna talk about gypsies open a new thread about them" do u not understand??!

Anyway, i wouldnt suggest u do that anymore, because its rather obvious such thread wont go "well".

Are you listening to yourself ?
How can you even suggest that ... ?

[The.Traveller]

It's curious for how long EU will survive...

[XFIRE]

Long enough for us not to worry.

[The.Traveller]

The big daddies of the countries now eat one another,France itself came with the idea of a unified Europe and it was France itself which was against a constitution of EU.The western states worry for their countries' autonomy,too much paranoism there.The evolution of EU is something to wonder about.So,XFIRE,till you die much can change.

[XFIRE]

Considering the fact that I'm moving to USA next year and it's a high probability that I won't be coming back ( only for national swimming contests, maybe ), I don't really care what will happen :)

[The.Traveller]

Hmm..i definitely care for Europe more than for USA.But money rule nowadays,i understand you ;P

[Rasta]

EU sux hard...

[Nikao]

for pore contries like mine(serbia) EU is self-destruction... they promise larger pays, less cost for purchaces etc. but its all paradox...

Serbia should become a kingdom

[The.Traveller]

for pore contries like mine(serbia) EU is self-destruction... they promise larger pays, less cost for purchaces etc. but its all paradox...

Serbia should become a kingdom

Let's better make a kingdom out of Greece.At least,Greece has experience in this area.
EU sux because the heads of the states sux.They can't decide who among them has a bigger pennis :dry:
EU,on the whole,is a good thing.

[Nikao]

Let's better make a kingdom out of Greece.At least,Greece has experience in this area.
EU sux because the heads of the states sux.They can't decide who among them has a bigger pennis :dry:
EU,on the whole,is a good thing.

who is "lets"? and greece is maybe better like this in this time but serbia is better like kingdom in this time

[The.Traveller]

who is "lets"? and greece is maybe better like this in this time but serbia is better like kingdom in this time

"Lets" is noone in particular.It is merely a sentence meant to,indirectly,bring you back in the real world where Serbia is just another country and the only european "kingdom" is EU.

[ribacbacri]

When we join EU, Eu will start to fall apart and we will be the last contry in EU